{"id":11771,"date":"2012-03-01T12:16:18","date_gmt":"2012-03-01T17:16:18","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/liveaction.org\/blog\/?p=11771"},"modified":"2013-04-02T21:31:47","modified_gmt":"2013-04-03T01:31:47","slug":"pro-lifers-need-to-defend-their-views-too","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/archive.liveaction.org\/news\/pro-lifers-need-to-defend-their-views-too\/","title":{"rendered":"Pro-lifers need to defend their views too"},"content":{"rendered":"
<\/div>

Don\u2019t you hate it when pro-choice advocates refuse to defend their views past one or two levels of argument?\u00a0 This has happened to me many times, and it\u2019s aggravating because the topic of abortion is so serious. \u00a0Lives are literally on the line, yet some people are too intellectually lazy to spend more than two minutes attempting to ground their views in something deeper than bumper sticker slogans.<\/p>\n

Yet for some reason, I\u2019m more annoyed when pro-lifers do the same thing.<\/p>\n

This happened to me recently in a debate that was bizarre on several levels, and there\u2019s a few lessons I\u2019d like to draw from it for the benefit of my friends and colleagues.\u00a0 Even though this debate took place publicly on Facebook, I\u2019m going to protect the person\u2019s identity and just refer to her as \u201cJ.\u201d\u00a0 Her comments are only adjusted for spelling and grammatical accuracy. I\u2019ll tell the story and end with a few lessons of application.<\/p>\n

<\/p>\n

Some acquaintances of mine were encouraging pro-lifers to post pro-life fliers around their towns on January 1st, 2012.\u00a0 Their hope was that a bunch of college students will see pro-life fliers appear on bulletin boards around campus and begin to rethink their position.\u00a0 Whether or not they got enough people to participate, I applaud them for their passion and creativity.<\/p>\n

As I perused the Facebook event page, I noticed a wall post by J that said,<\/p>\n

\u201c<\/em>I will be putting pictures ON Planned Parenthoods. :)”<\/span><\/em><\/p><\/blockquote>\n

I responded that this would actually be illegal, and J countered:<\/span><\/p>\n

“You are allowed to go to a Planned Parenthood public clinic.\u00a0 Anyone is. I have put pro-life stickers that come off easily on their property before.\u00a0 They called the cops, and the cops said I did NOT break the law. :)\u00a0 The only way they can keep me off is a no trespassing order since they are a public clinic that is tax funded.\u00a0 mwoahahhaha till then!”<\/em><\/p><\/blockquote>\n

I began a dialogue with her about the issue.\u00a0 I won\u2019t post the entire thread, (J ended up deleting the entire thing when she promptly ended all debate,) but I will sum up the main arguments J made for her position:<\/p>\n

    \n
  1. My parents are officers, my dad is the town\u2019s Chief of Police and they confirmed what the other local officers said about me being allowed to put stickers on PP property.<\/li>\n
  2. I\u2019m not saying everyone has to do this, but I\u2019m going to do it. \u201cTo each their own.\u201d<\/li>\n<\/ol>\n

    I responded that I\u2019m not just worried about her getting in trouble but her harming other pro-life activities in her area.\u00a0 \u201cBubble zone laws\u201d have been passed in some cities without any pro-life infractions, as in the case of Walter Hoye<\/a>.\u00a0 Imagine how much easier it would be to pass a bubble zone law in a city where the abortion facility has video tape of a pro-lifer purposefully defacing the property!\u00a0 J j<\/span>ust repeated her \u201cto each their own\u201d mantra.<\/p>\n

    Do you see the irony here? <\/strong>\u00a0One of the most common pro-choice arguments<\/span> dismissive statements is \u201cdon\u2018t like abortion, don\u2018t have one,\u201d but that statement completely misses the point of our pro-life case.\u00a0 We don\u2019t merely believe elective abortion is wrong for us individually.\u00a0 We believe elective abortion is wrong for everyone.<\/p>\n

    It\u2019s not like choosing a favorite ice cream flavor.\u00a0 I like chocolate peanut butter, you like vanilla.\u00a0 (For some mysterious reason.)\u00a0 \u201cDon\u2019t like chocolate peanut butter, don\u2019t eat chocolate peanut butter.\u201d\u00a0 No, we believe that elective abortion is wrong for virtually everybody because it kills a living, distinct, whole human being.\u00a0 The statement \u201cdon\u2019t like abortion, don\u2019t have one\u201d tries to transform our objective claim to a merely subjective one that is easy to dismiss.<\/p>\n

    Imagine if someone told William Wilberforce, \u201cDon\u2019t like slavery, don\u2019t own a slave.\u201d\u00a0 They would have been missing the abolitionists\u2019 point.\u00a0 They didn\u2019t just not like<\/em> slavery; they thought slavery was objectively wrong<\/em> because it dehumanized a whole community of human beings.<\/p>\n

    I explained to J that my argument is: her action may (as a matter of objective fact) actually harm pro-life activities in her area.\u00a0 Thus, her \u201cdon\u2019t like it, don\u2019t do it\u201d argument is comparable to dismissing my objective claim with a statement similar to \u201cdon\u2019t like abortion, don\u2019t have one.\u201d\u00a0 Unfortunately, she just reacted by being upset that I was comparing what she said to \u201ca pro-abort statement.\u201d<\/p>\n

    At this point I attempted to simply clarify the facts of what her Dad\/Police Chief told her, and asked if her father could call me and explain why J’s actions would be legal.\u00a0Her response?<\/span><\/p>\n

    “Thanks :) that is all. God Bless. \u2665”<\/em><\/p><\/blockquote>\n

    Instead of offering evidence, she simply ended the conversation. She added:<\/p>\n

    “I will also say if sidewalk counseling makes you uneasy then find something else that works for you.\u201d<\/em><\/p><\/blockquote>\n

    I responded:<\/p>\n

    I’m not at all uneasy about sidewalk counseling. I created the Fresno sidewalk counseling training ministry. I’m concerned about your actions because I think it could result in LESS sidewalk counseling in your area.<\/em><\/p>\n

    I respect your passion for pro-life. I’m just trying to learn why this action would be legal.<\/em><\/p><\/blockquote>\n

    She responded that she\u2019s done talking about it, so in a last ditch effort, I said:<\/p>\n

    I will respect your request to not continue debating it. Would you please ask your dad to contact me and inform me why my understanding of the law is inaccurate? He can email me at Josh@RightToLifeCA.org<\/a> or call my office at 559-229-BABY (2229)<\/em><\/p><\/blockquote>\n

    She refused to ask her dad to contact me and she also refused to find one legal expert that would agree with her legal assessment.<\/p>\n

    She was later encouraged by an admin of that event to not do anything that would get her in trouble, yet she responded with her boldest statement yet:<\/p>\n

    \u201cI have done this before, both my parents are cops, my best friend is a cop, I WORK with cops (fire dept) … I am not breaking the damned law.\u00a0 [I\u2019m] seriously not okay with people whining on this.\u201d<\/strong><\/em><\/p><\/blockquote>\n

    End of story. Here\u2019s the point: be willing to defend your views<\/strong>. Give a reason for the claim you are making or explain it in different terms so that you extend the conversation instead of simply shutting it down.\u00a0 It\u2019s what we want pro-choice people to do (or attempt to do) when we talk with them.<\/p>\n

    Why do we sometimes get this attitude like we\u2019re above that?\u00a0 Probably because we aren\u2019t open-minded.\u00a0 If you truly think that right now even one of the millions of beliefs you have is false and that you\u2019re on a journey to learn more true things and fewer false ones, then you will embrace dialogues like this, to test your ideas as well as other peoples ideas.<\/p>\n

    Are there some dialogues that are not worth having?\u00a0 Yes.\u00a0 Here are a few examples where that is the case:<\/p>\n

    You\u2019re talking to a bully. <\/strong>\u00a0If I was bullying J or showed that I didn\u2019t really care to know why she believes what she believes and was just trying to vomit my opinion on her, I think it would be more defensible for J to politely bow out of the conversation after a while.\u00a0 As Scott Klusendorf said on Life Report last year<\/a>, \u201cThere are Learners and there are Crusaders.\u201d\u00a0 You should spend most of your time with the Learners. You should also make it your goal to be a Learner yourself.<\/p>\n

    You\u2019ve already answered all the questions.<\/strong>\u00a0 There are some issues where you can debate every layer of it and still disagree on much of it.\u00a0 At some point, both people are going to be ready to call it a day, but that usually comes when both parties know they\u2019ve run out of questions and challenges for the other, and can then resign themselves to the fact that they just disagree right now.\u00a0 At least one of them is still wrong about the subject, but today\u2019s debate was not enough to persuade either of them.\u00a0 It happens.<\/p>\n

    \"\"

    Photo Credit: JFAweb.org<\/p><\/div>\n

    There\u2019s a time-sensitive issue at play.<\/strong> In the Spring of 2011 Justice For All came to Fresno State, and there was some down-time right after lunch where almost no one was hanging around to talk about abortion, except the guy in the picture on the right.\u00a0 I continued to talk with him for 45 minutes because 1) he wanted to talk, and 2) even though he didn\u2019t seem open-minded, I didn’t have others to talk to, so trusting God to work through this conversation He was making available, I continued.\u00a0 However, when it was clear that there were others to talk to, I politely ended the conversation, trusting that God would use the time I had spent with this gentleman in whatever way He deemed appropriate.<\/p>\n

    The difficult thing about decisions like this is that it\u2019s hard to know which conversations are actually<\/em> productive.\u00a0 I had a 75-minute conversation<\/a>with a pro-choice woman at Fresno State that same weekend that didn\u2019t seem to be going anywhere until the last 5 minutes when she said, \u201cI hadn\u2019t thought of that before. I guess I won\u2019t have an abortion if I get pregnant now.\u201d<\/p>\n

    As Steve Wagner<\/a>, the Director of Training at Justice For All<\/em><\/a>, says,<\/p>\n

    \u201cBecause we don\u2019t know what\u2019s actually going on in the mind of the person we\u2019re talking with, we should prayerfully make decisions on which conversations seem to be most productive.\u00a0 Here are some of the factors I consider in making those decisions:\u00a0 Is the person I’m talking to open to rethinking?\u00a0 Is she open to discarding false views, working through her questions, or considering the arguments I’m presenting?\u00a0 Is God working through the conversation to help <\/em>me rethink?\u00a0 If the answer is yes to any of these questions, I tends to think the conversation is worth having.\u201d<\/em><\/p><\/blockquote>\n

    Feel free to add more examples in the comments.<\/strong><\/p>\n

    Pro-life advocates ought to be known as thoughtful people, and part of being thoughtful means thinking carefully about your views, and then when alternative ideas are offered, defending your view, or if the other person\u2019s arguments are superior to yours, being willing to change your mind.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

    Don\u2019t you hate it when pro-choice advocates refuse to defend their views past one or two levels of argument? 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